TeamCapri

Tech, Repairs, Upgrades => Engine & Drivetrain Swaps => Topic started by: Rocketman on September 24, 2013, 11:02:26 AM

Title: BP Swap
Post by: Rocketman on September 24, 2013, 11:02:26 AM
The 1.8L Mazda DOHC known as the "BP" engine is becoming a more common swap into the Capri. There are JDM versions with a turbo, known as the BPT & BPD. They come from a second gen 323 (BG chassis) GTX & GTR, respectively. The BPD has the highest power output, around 210hp. IIRC the BPT puts down 180hp.

The nonturbo BP was available here in the states in the Ford Escort GT, some Mercury Tracers, Mazda Proteges and some Kia's in FWD format. Certain year Miata's also came with a BP but they're RWD, necessitating location of all the FWD accessories. The "best" option is the Mazda Protege BP closely followed by the Escort GT, they are the closest match to our cars.

Physically, the BP is about an inch longer than the stock 1.6L engine. This creates clearance issues. Also for this reason, the manifolds do not interchange. You will need a complete BP with manifolds.

Off the top of my head, here are the physical modifications needed to fit an Protege/EGT BP into a Capri XR2 (will go over NA further down)
-Clearance the passenger framerail. This can be done by cutting/welding or creative use of a hammer. You will need an additional 1/2 to 3/4" around the engine & alternator pulley.
-Passenger engine mount will need work. You will need to swap the B6T engine bracket onto the BP & cut the timing cover backing plate to go around it. The B6T unit *may* work. The mount will be further over, slot the 3x holes on the mount itself and slot the bolt holes in the bracket on the vehicle to move it further toward the fender.
-The fuel lines on the BP are a different location. Use correct high-pressure fuel injection hose to route new ones. The Protege uses barb style fuel rail (like stock) the Escort uses quick-disconnects. If you end up with an Escort engine, try to source a Protege fuel rail.
-The throttlebody & intake tract will be re-located. You will have to come up with a whole new intake piping system. This will depend on turbo/na applications & is up to you. Note that the BP throttle will be very close to the brake master cylinder, using a silicone coupler/bend here with a tight radius can help with clearance.
-The exhaust downpipe will be in a different location. Plan on fabricating a new downpipe for both NA & turbo BP swaps
-If mated to an XR2 transmission, the oil pan will not bolt up in all places. Just bolt together what does line up - the other bolts are not critical.
-The XR2 intermediate shaft will no longer line up with bolt bosses on the block. By welding on an extension to the bracket & re-drilling it can be made to fit. You can also source a newer Kia axle which deletes the intermediate shaft but may have unknown effects on torque steer.
-The throttle cable does not fit the BP throttle as-is. The throttle cam can be modified to accommodate it but there may be better solutions - maybe swapping a stock cam gear onto it?

I believe that's it for the physical work, there may be small details I am looking over. It's been several years since I did the swap.

Electronics:
I do not have a writeup for electrical concerns with the BP. If you have a turbo BP, you can use XR2 electronics - ecu, harness, injectors, distributor, knockbox, etc. If you buy a JDM BP with harness, try using it. Use the stock start/charge harness, it is separate.
If you are swapping in a nonturbo BP, I would recommend using the BP harness, ecu & electronics. The BP harness and B6 harnesses have a bulkhead connector where they connect to the body harness - you will need to sort out a dozen or so wires here, it shouldn't be too difficult. Things like power, switched power, gauge signals and such travel through here. If you get to this point I will be happy to help sort it out.

Notes for N/A capris:
I have seen a BP swap on an automatic capri before. This seems viable, though I question the reliabilty of the transmission.
The nonturbo manuals capris have an F-Series transmission. The BP will indeed bolt to this, but you are at a disadvantage. The clutch and flywheel are smaller, and will definitely need an upgrade to hold the BP's power. Beating on it will more than likely result in a blown f-series transmission, they're just not build to hold that kind of power.
-The N/A manual capris could benefit from swapping the whole BP + protege/egt transmission. This is a whole new can of worms but a good option. You will need Capri XR2 axles (or the capri/kia combo mentioned above), and the engine mounts will need different modifications from those discussed above. The BP transmission is different - it tilts the engine forward several degrees. It is also hydraulic so the stock clutch master cylinder can be used.

Hope this helps, sorry it may not be super clear but there's a lot of possible BP engines into a lot of possible Capri options, lol. If you need clarification please ask!
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: Advancedynamix on February 10, 2014, 10:11:52 PM
Been thinking about going BP in my XR2.  I have all the stuff necessary to BPT it, and I am pulling the b6t to reseal it and do a clutch anyway, so why not just bite the bullet and go big. Has anyone other than Matt (thank you for the write up Matt) done this swap?
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: Rocketman on February 11, 2014, 08:32:39 AM
I've seen 5 or 6 other Capris with a BP swap.

There was a gent on the Yahoo! group who swapped one into his Automatic
There was someone in New jersey who had a BPT swap with a custom turbo setup, but wanted crazy money ($7K?) for it. Engine looked good but the rest of the car looked hacked. Not sure whatever happened to it, this was 4-6 years ago
Dean Fayzal from Australia has a two show cars, one a 100% chromed B6T, the other has a BPT. He's on here, but I don't see him much
There's another red capri in Australia with a BP and some absolutely massive crazy huge turbo bolted to it, if it spools at all I'd be surprised lol

That's what I can remember off the top of my head. there's probably more undocumented swaps out there
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: fchalvet on June 30, 2014, 06:21:30 AM
I need help please!
I left my NA capri to someone who had done a BP swap.
But He didn't finish his job and I try to find a solution. It's even almost impossible to put the 1.6 back, as I have lost a lot of parts, fuse box, etc..

Right now I have the BP ECU and harness.
However I'm completly lost to connect the black connector from the Capri harness to the BP harness, on the passenger side.
Also I have the BP fuses box, and my other problem will be to connect the Capri harness on it, for the lights, etc
Hope someone can help me
Thanks
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: Rocketman on June 30, 2014, 08:13:01 PM
I think you need to keep the Capri charging harness & fusebox.

The wiring on the big black connector is pretty straight forward, admittedly I have not done it myself though. You will need a diagram for the Capri connector, and one for the BP connector, the wires are mostly all the same just different location.

There is a BP swap wiring guide on the Yahoo! 323 GTX group. It's from the early 2000's, I don't know how accurate it is - but might be worth looking into
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: fchalvet on July 01, 2014, 01:10:14 PM
Thanks for your answer.
Yes I thought that I would need to use the Capri fusebox. I will try to find it back...

I have the Capri book but it's not good to use...maybe the 323 will work better if I can find it. And yes the BP diagram too.

I will try to see in the GTX group if I can find something
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: azgtx on July 01, 2014, 08:29:08 PM
Why didn't you just run the BP off of the Capri B6D electronics?
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: fchalvet on July 02, 2014, 05:55:08 AM
For now I want to try that way...this engine is supposed to be something like 170hp, with a special Ecu , cylinder head, 1.3L gearbox, etc
But I'm still not sure to have my parts back, the fuse box and the charging harness...this guy stole me!
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: fchalvet on July 02, 2014, 05:57:58 AM
Anyway, here a pic of it

(http://i39.servimg.com/u/f39/18/84/57/40/bp10.jpg)
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: Rocketman on July 02, 2014, 06:57:46 AM
1.3L gearbox??

That engine is not mounted down is it? From the picture it appears to be sitting at some crazy angle, as if it were using the stock BP passenger mount/bracket. You have to use the Capri bracket/mount with some modifications
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: fchalvet on July 02, 2014, 08:08:09 AM
1.3 gear box so you can use a lighter flywheel then more torque

I agree with you about the engine. yes it's mounted down and not right.
The guy said that he used the Capri mount and then a custom one, made from the 323...
I probably will have to change that if I decide to keep this engine
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: Rocketman on July 02, 2014, 09:42:07 AM
The 1.3 gearbox is horrifically weak and not rated to take the tq of a BP. You need to get the stock gearbox back.

There are aluminum lightweight flywheels available for the 1.6 and 1.8L engines, that weigh in at ~9lbs which is lighter than the 1.3 flywheel. It has no effect on 'more torque' though - it frees up some mass so the engine revs free, and makes the care more agile to drive - but overall total tq stays exactly the same
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: fchalvet on July 02, 2014, 11:07:09 AM
I don't know..the guy  used  this gearbox for long with all his 1.8L engines and has never broke one.
I tried his 323GT 160 hp and the car was amazing with it.
Anyway as I said I'm not sure to keep this engine, and if I do then I will have to buy a 323 to get all the missing parts..so I will have a stock gearbox in case
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: chrispoe on July 02, 2014, 11:28:01 AM
I agree with Rocketman, get your old tranny back. The 1.3l tranny is a E series and won't hold more then 100 ft/lbs of torque reliabily.
The F series transmission is good up to 150 ft/lbs and the G series transmission is good for 200+ ft/lbs.
Both the F and G transmissions are more then strong enough to hold a N/A BP.


Try to get your old wiring back, but if you can't get your old electronics back, I do have my old electrical notes for wiring the BP engine into my Capri.  It uses the BP's charging and engine harness with fuel relay,  and the BG chassis fusebox from an escort GT.
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: Rocketman on July 02, 2014, 06:51:38 PM
I don't know..the guy  used  this gearbox for long with all his 1.8L engines and has never broke one.
I tried his 323GT 160 hp and the car was amazing with it.
Anyway as I said I'm not sure to keep this engine, and if I do then I will have to buy a 323 to get all the missing parts..so I will have a stock gearbox in case

Keep the engine! There are not nearly enough BP swapped capris out there. Where are you from, btw?

The E trans is junk, ive seen many shredded ones on FordFestiva.com where they put all sorts of engines up to them. Theyll hold if you baby the car but what fun is that? The XR2 trans is a holy grail for them for swap purposes because it can hold some extra power.

You could source an escort GT transmission which will is another G series but it mounts differently, it may work better with the BP though
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: Rocketman on July 02, 2014, 06:54:25 PM
I agree with Rocketman, get your old tranny back. The 1.3l tranny is a E series and won't hold more then 100 ft/lbs of torque reliabily.
The F series transmission is good up to 150 ft/lbs and the G series transmission is good for 200+ ft/lbs.
Both the F and G transmissions are more then strong enough to hold a N/A BP.


Try to get your old wiring back, but if you can't get your old electronics back, I do have my old electrical notes for wiring the BP engine into my Capri.  It uses the BP's charging and engine harness with fuel relay,  and the BG chassis fusebox from an escort GT.

Is yours the auto BP car Ive seen on the Yahoo! Group?
Would you mind posting your wiring notes just for reference sake? Would be a big help to us
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: fchalvet on July 03, 2014, 11:48:27 AM
Yes I will do my best to keep this engine, this is really what I wanted for my Capri.
I saw a 323GT for sale after an accident, if I can get it then I will have all the parts that I need and more. I  don't even have the right clutch pedal.
I live in France, there is probably less than 5 Capri here so that's why it's hard for me to find parts. I'm still trying to get my wiring back, but if I have electric notes, for sure it will help me. For now I havn't found anything to help, even about the black connector on the passenger side
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: azgtx on July 03, 2014, 07:36:59 PM
Matt he is in France.
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: Rocketman on July 03, 2014, 11:41:42 PM
Here's the wiring info from the 323GTX Yahoo! group. It should be almost the same for the Capri:

Quote from: 323GTX Group
B6T to BPT wiring harness connections using 88 B6T GTX and 90 EA BPT Protégé wiring diagrams. By George B with feedback from Bob B.

For reference from 88 to 89 manual:
X-03 = FEM-01
B-01 = EM-02
X-24 = FEM-03
X-04 = FEM-02
X-08 = FE-02

0) Engine Fan Power
Connect: B6T connector X-03 Blue (F)
To: B6T connector X-03 Yellow (F)

1) Fan Idle control
Connect: BPT B2a connector X-04 B/G
To: B6T B2a connector X-03 Y/G

2) Turbo Buzzer
Connect: BPT B2c connector X-03 R/Y
To: B6T B2b connector X-03 V

3) Turbo Lamp
Connect: BPT B2c connector X-03 W/G (the schematic color is called out as P, but the harness is actually W/G)
To: B6T B2b connector X-03 W/L

4) AC relay
Connect: BPT B2c connector X-03 L/B
To: B6T B2a connector B-01 W

5) AC SW Idle control
Connect: BPT B2c connector X-03 G/B
To: B6T B2a connector B-01 R

6) Lights on, Idle
Connect: BPT B2c connector X-03 R/B
To: B6T B2b connector X-03 R/B

7) Blower on, Idle
Connect: BPT B2c connector X-04 O/L
To: B6T B2b connector X-03 L/G

8) Brake Light, Idle
Connect: BPT B2c connector X-04 G
To: B6T B2a connector X-24 W/G

9) Rear Window defrost, Idle
Connect: BPT B2c connector X-04 B/L
To: B6T B2b connector X-03 B/Y

10)  ECU power
Connect: BPT B2a connector X-04 L/R
To: B6T B2a connector X-03 L/R

11)  Tach
 Connect: BPT B2c connector B2-08 Y/L
 To: B6T B2b connector X-04 Y/L

12)  Circuit opening relay, to ECU
 Connect: BPT A1 connector X-18 V
 To: B6T A2 connector X-03 B/R

13)  OK
14)  OK
15)  OK

16)  Coil
 Connect: BPT B2b connector B2-07 L Cut into near coil
 To: B6T B2a connector X-04 B/W Butt splice together

17)  Power steering Sw OK

18)  Power to Fuel Pump
 Connect: BPT B2a connector B2-03 B/P
 To: B6T B2a connector X-03 G/R (connects to aux relay)

18 alternate) Power to fuel pump
Connect: BPT B-2a connector X-04 G/O
To: B6T B-2a connector X-03 G/R  (two wires)
 
There is a G/O wire in the X-04 connector but it doesn’t pin out correct to the diagram I think it is the right wire though. I don't know what the effect of using the fancy fuel relay that is already in the BPT EM harness is but it seem like the circuit makes sense making this connection. Yes, this will work--if you can find the right wire on X-04. This will give you an ECU controlled two speed fuel pump. I didn't find a G/O on my X-04.
 
For #18 as an alternate to adding a relay would this work I take back what I said about the #18 B/P not able to supply the current needed by the fuel pump. That's the only power source going to the BPT fuel pump. Still, it feels marginal to me. I added my own power wire to insure the pump gets maximum voltage and therefore fuel pressure/ flow.
ß
19)  Temp Gauge
 Connect: BPT C connector X-14 B/O
 To: B6T C connector X-08 Y/W

20)  Main Relay from BPT, Bottom View
______
| A  B   |_
|            _ |
| C  D   |

A & B switched contacts, connect to B6T connector X-18 (EM) W/R and B6T B-18 L, under fuse box.
   C connect to ground
   D connect to switched +V, B6T B-44 or B-45 B/Y

Also for the switched power source for pin D on #20 how about this.
 
20d
Connect: BPT B-2a connector X-04 L
To: B6t B-2a connector X-03 B/W (two wires) connect the end of the blue wire in the engine compartment to pin D on the main fuel relay.
This makes the power source more similar to the wiring schematic and uses the unused coil power wire in the EM harness. The only problem I'm having is there are 3 B/W wires in the B6t X-03 connector. I haven't figured out which one is the third one and what it goes to.

21) Move Normally Closed cooling fan relay control switches from B6T engine to          replace Normally Open switches on BPT engine; keep B6T fan relays


Also I don't know if you want to mess with the clutch switch but It hooks directly to the ECU I'm not sure what the ecu does with the signal but I think It will make it so you can start the car with the transmission in gear and the clutch depressed without it the transmission would have to be in neutral. It can be disabled by just grounding the BR/Y wire I think. Notice the B6T clutch and neutral switches are open when the BPT switches are closed. That's why the BPT clutch and neutral switches are in parallel not in series like the B6T. If you ground the BR/Y you'll be able to start it any time. I left off the clutch switch (I didn't want to change it). I also swapped over my reverse switch from the B6T tranny so it will plug into the B6T harness connector.
 
Clutch switch
Connect: BPT B-2c connector X-04 BR/Y
To: B6t B-2c connector X-03 Br/B This will work IF you replace/ install a BP clutch switch.

Source of the file: https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/323gtx/files/B6T%20to%20BPT%20wiring%20harness%20con./
Can't vouch for it's correctness personally but I haven't heard anything otherwise.
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: fchalvet on July 06, 2014, 02:40:05 AM
Thank you very much for this writing info.
It will be a good help.
I probably will have my fusebox back next wenesday, so that's good.
I'm also looking for the Capri wiring diagram book, I saw few of them on Ebay.

Just one question, when you talked about the charging harness, do you mean the main harness, where the ECU is connected to? or the one in the fender connected to the lights?

Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: azgtx on July 06, 2014, 01:28:44 PM
Charging harness is the harness going to the starter, alternator and various other goodies on the back of the block.
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: fchalvet on July 06, 2014, 02:54:53 PM
Thanks, I remember this harness now, I hope will get it back

Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: chrispoe on July 07, 2014, 11:09:27 AM
Is yours the auto BP car Ive seen on the Yahoo! Group?
Would you mind posting your wiring notes just for reference sake? Would be a big help to us

There's a Capri with an automatic BP on Yahoo groups? The only Capri's with BP engines on Yahoo that I'm aware of is yours and mine. My Yahoo handle is Lovefool524 and I do have my Capri on there, but my car is not an automatic, it's a 91 N/A.

I found my schematics, but 13 years of age has taken a toll on them. I did the under dash wiring with pen and notepad and they're still legible, but the fusebox schematics were printed and almost half of them have faded out of exsistance. As of right now, I'm working on converting what's left to a digital format.
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: fchalvet on October 14, 2014, 10:47:07 AM
Some news about my BP swap.
It's almost done now. It was longer than expected, as I discovered that the engine installed by the guy, was not good. So I had to find an other one of course.
I decided to keep a F-serie transmission, at least for now.  I still have some work to do, on the passenger mount and few things around..but now the engine is at the right place, not like on the pic that I posted before!
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: StreetDoc on June 08, 2015, 09:03:25 PM
Okay, quick question about this swap, I found this engine on ebay...http://www.ebay.com/itm/89-94-MAZDA-FAMILIA-PROTEGE-323-GTX-DOHC-ENGINE-AWD-MANUAL-TRANS-ECU-JDM-BP-T-/291484901925?hash=item43dddaa225&vxp=mtr (http://www.ebay.com/itm/89-94-MAZDA-FAMILIA-PROTEGE-323-GTX-DOHC-ENGINE-AWD-MANUAL-TRANS-ECU-JDM-BP-T-/291484901925?hash=item43dddaa225&vxp=mtr). Is it possible to fit the BPT engine in the capri with 4x4 trans?
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: Rocketman on June 09, 2015, 08:38:21 AM
Not if you're going to keep it FWD.

Remove the trans, and the BPT will bolt directly to the XR2 transmission.
There's a lot of the AWD Mazda folks looking for BPT transmissions as spares/replacements, you'll make a good amount of your money back re-selling it.
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: StreetDoc on June 09, 2015, 04:56:32 PM
Thanks for the info. I have NO mechanic knowledge.
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: Gaz on June 20, 2015, 07:08:36 AM
So, I take it you can use the b6 na ecu with an na bp?
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: chrispoe on June 20, 2015, 08:55:23 AM
So, I take it you can use the b6 na ecu with an na bp?

Yes you can by swaping over the B6’s distributor, injectors, sensors, ect …to the BP.
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: Crapi Attitude on July 22, 2016, 09:14:21 AM
If anyone is wondering how difficult this swap is, I did it successfully with no experience, with hand tools, while really drunk. The car is a mess.

A fast mess.
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: greywolf27030 on July 22, 2016, 10:08:18 AM
So, I take it you can use the b6 na ecu with an na bp?

Yes you can by swaping over the B6’s distributor, injectors, sensors, ect …to the BP.

Does this cause any loss of performance?

Jack

Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: chrispoe on July 22, 2016, 10:36:35 AM
The stock Capri ecu/wiring doesn’t support VICS intake manifolds,  so you’ll lose some power in the low end or the top end depending on which way position the valves. 
The only other thing would be that the ignition timing is proactively controlled by the ecu with the BG setup vs. the Capri’s reactive distribitor controlled setup.
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: WashiestSnake on July 22, 2016, 08:16:35 PM
If anyone is wondering how difficult this swap is, I did it successfully with no experience, with hand tools, while really drunk. The car is a mess.

A fast mess.
Id love to see pictures/write up on how to do it. I don't have much experience working on cars, but the idea of the swap is really daunting.
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: Crapi Attitude on July 23, 2016, 07:30:59 AM
I used a 1994 Escort GT engine. You need to swap the engine mount and accessories from the Capri engine to the Escort engine. The timing belt has to come off for this. Swap all the electrical parts from the Capri to the Escort engine, including injectors, but use the Escort fuel rail. Use the throttle body from an automatic Escort GT (four wire. The plug is different but the signals are the same as the Capri unit). You probably want to swap the clutch slave cylinder for one from an Escort or Protege, as the Capri one won't clear the engine face plate. I used the Capri slave mounted at a cockeyed angle because I'm cheap and lazy. I used an engine set up for an automatic car, so the oil pan included a sealing surface/face plate for the torque converter. This won't clear the subframe. Either find the correct oil pan or whittle it down with a Sawzall (See 'cheap and lazy' above). Drink enough liquor to make this seem like a good idea, go.

Thats about it. The Capri ECU runs it fine. The throttle tip-in was way more aggressive that I expected; I crashed into the trash cans the first time I drove it.
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: azgtx on July 23, 2016, 07:56:10 PM
Also, to lose the VICS on the BP you can use the BG GTX intake manifold which does not use it.
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: Crapi Attitude on July 23, 2016, 10:03:47 PM
Just leave the VICS. Its fine. I'm going to wire mine to a switch.
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: Crapi Attitude on July 24, 2016, 07:34:30 PM
Say, does anyone know how fast you can safely spin a BP? There seems to be no mechanism to limit engine speed on my setup.
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: chrispoe on July 24, 2016, 09:44:05 PM
I used a 1994 Escort GT engine. You need to swap the engine mount and accessories from the Capri engine to the Escort engine. The timing belt has to come off for this. Swap all the electrical parts from the Capri to the Escort engine, including injectors, but use the Escort fuel rail. Use the throttle body from an automatic Escort GT (four wire. The plug is different but the signals are the same as the Capri unit). You probably want to swap the clutch slave cylinder for one from an Escort or Protege, as the Capri one won't clear the engine face plate. I used the Capri slave mounted at a cockeyed angle because I'm cheap and lazy. I used an engine set up for an automatic car, so the oil pan included a sealing surface/face plate for the torque converter. This won't clear the subframe. Either find the correct oil pan or whittle it down with a Sawzall (See 'cheap and lazy' above). Drink enough liquor to make this seem like a good idea, go.

Thats about it. The Capri ECU runs it fine. The throttle tip-in was way more aggressive that I expected; I crashed into the trash cans the first time I drove it.
I used a 92 escort engine that had a MTX, the oil pan flange with additional mounting holes extended beyond the tranny, but I didn't have any clearance issues with the crossmember. As for the clutch, I just cut a small 1 inch piece off the oil pan flange with a jigsaw to make room for the clutch slave cylinder.
Also, did you do any clearancing of the engine bay sidewall for the alternator puley? cuz I didn't do it with my swap.


Just leave the VICS. Its fine. I'm going to wire mine to a switch.
IMHO…The GTX manifold would be a downgrade for N/A use. I would leave the VICS in and use a rpm switch to activate it. Here’s one for $45.
https://www.summitracing.com/parts/sum-830449-1?seid=srese1&cm_mmc=pla-google-_-shopping-_-srese1-_-summit-racing&gclid=Cj0KEQjwztG8BRCJgseTvZLctr8BEiQAA_kBD166Tbeef-CXSZcdnhIbWZbfveBxtYo1NdNKXgKcPMMaAlXg8P8HAQ



Say, does anyone know how fast you can safely spin a BP? There seems to be no mechanism to limit engine speed on my setup.
I run my BP over 7000 rpm all the time and I haven’t had any problems yet.

Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: Crapi Attitude on July 25, 2016, 05:20:51 AM
Quote
Also, did you do any clearancing of the engine bay sidewall for the alternator puley? cuz I didn't do it with my swap.

I didn't. Its tight, but it fits. I did put a smaller (correct) diameter pulley on. Bosch alt, if that matters.

Your RPM switch is intriguing. Any idea if it can switch the solenoid directly, or should I use a relay?
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: chrispoe on July 25, 2016, 09:03:19 AM
The switch I linked to can handle 3 amps and it’s more than powerful enough to energize a solenoid directly.

Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: WashiestSnake on July 25, 2016, 09:30:00 AM
I used a 1994 Escort GT engine. You need to swap the engine mount and accessories from the Capri engine to the Escort engine. The timing belt has to come off for this. Swap all the electrical parts from the Capri to the Escort engine, including injectors, but use the Escort fuel rail. Use the throttle body from an automatic Escort GT (four wire. The plug is different but the signals are the same as the Capri unit). You probably want to swap the clutch slave cylinder for one from an Escort or Protege, as the Capri one won't clear the engine face plate. I used the Capri slave mounted at a cockeyed angle because I'm cheap and lazy. I used an engine set up for an automatic car, so the oil pan included a sealing surface/face plate for the torque converter. This won't clear the subframe. Either find the correct oil pan or whittle it down with a Sawzall (See 'cheap and lazy' above). Drink enough liquor to make this seem like a good idea, go.

Thats about it. The Capri ECU runs it fine. The throttle tip-in was way more aggressive that I expected; I crashed into the trash cans the first time I drove it.
I used a 92 escort engine that had a MTX, the oil pan flange with additional mounting holes extended beyond the tranny, but I didn't have any clearance issues with the crossmember. As for the clutch, I just cut a small 1 inch piece off the oil pan flange with a jigsaw to make room for the clutch slave cylinder.
Also, did you do any clearancing of the engine bay sidewall for the alternator puley? cuz I didn't do it with my swap.


Just leave the VICS. Its fine. I'm going to wire mine to a switch.
IMHO…The GTX manifold would be a downgrade for N/A use. I would leave the VICS in and use a rpm switch to activate it. Here’s one for $45.
https://www.summitracing.com/parts/sum-830449-1?seid=srese1&cm_mmc=pla-google-_-shopping-_-srese1-_-summit-racing&gclid=Cj0KEQjwztG8BRCJgseTvZLctr8BEiQAA_kBD166Tbeef-CXSZcdnhIbWZbfveBxtYo1NdNKXgKcPMMaAlXg8P8HAQ



Say, does anyone know how fast you can safely spin a BP? There seems to be no mechanism to limit engine speed on my setup.
I run my BP over 7000 rpm all the time and I haven’t had any problems yet.
Couldn't a switch like that be used on a BP4W to activate the VVT?
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: chrispoe on July 25, 2016, 10:03:47 AM
Couldn't a switch like that be used on a BP4W to activate the VVT?

No, the RPM switch is just an on/off signal to control a vacuum solenoid.

Controlling VVT on a BP4W is far more complicated than just an on/off signal. The ECU takes things like engine RPM, load, temperature, cam , and crank positions to determine what the optimal cam timing should be and then sends a constantly varying signal to a variable oil pressure valve that changes the cam timing via a hydraulically actuated rotor.
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: WashiestSnake on August 14, 2016, 12:42:03 AM
Hey Chris what year/s Escort GTs am I looking for? Im gonna go down to the junkyard here soon, and I want to start grabbing some stuff. I might pick up a engine If i can get it for a good price.
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: chrispoe on August 15, 2016, 09:39:48 AM
Here’s a small snippet from my “work in progess” N/A swap guide


Next pick your engine. I recommend going to a junkyard and finding a 91-96 Ford Escort Gt or a 91-94 Mazda Protégé LX donor car. All of the parts you’ll need for doing a N/A swap should be there.

Note #1: the protégé has barbs on the ends of its fuel rails for connecting the fuel lines ( similar to our Capri). The escort has quick disconnects on its fuel rail. You can use the escort’s fuel rail still if you grab the quick disconnect connectors that go onto the fuel rail (they still do have barbs on the ends of them)
Note #2: MTX and ATX equipped BPs have different throttle position sensors. The MTX TPS has three wires and is just a pair of switches that tell the ecu if the throttle plate is fully closed or open. The ATX TPS has four wires and contains a idle switch and a potentiometer similar to the Capri.


What you’ll need from the donor:
The BP engine
Exhaust manifold and down pipe
Intake manifold with fuel rail, throttle body assy w/IAC and an ATX TPS
intake plenum tube and engine wire harness
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: WashiestSnake on August 15, 2016, 04:53:03 PM
Thanks!
 While im out there should I grab the Escort G-series or will my F-series hold up to the torque?
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: chrispoe on August 17, 2016, 08:34:08 AM
The F series tranny is more then strong enough to handle a N/A BP.
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: azgtx on August 17, 2016, 10:13:03 AM
Agreed but it will all depend on how you treat it. You will need to remember the bp tilts 11* to the front and using the f series will mount it straight up. The oil pan is designed for the tilt. Talk to Matt on this but should not be  an issue.
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: chrispoe on August 19, 2016, 11:05:16 AM
If you’re dumping the clutch at 5k+ rpm  to do burnouts or doing flat footed shifts, the F-series tranny won’t live very long. Then again the G-series won’t last much longer under those same conditions either…LOL


The oil pan tilt isn't a problem, I've never had my oil pressure drop below 30psi after 70K+ miles now.
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: WashiestSnake on August 19, 2016, 12:58:29 PM
Yea, I really dont hoon my car. I guess ill just stick with the f-series, and then just switch to the g-series whenever I get the GTX parts.
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: Rocketman on August 22, 2016, 08:23:27 AM
The issue with the oil pan, what with it being cast aluminum, the back hangs down real low. I think I scraped mine once or twice.
It's a risk to hit stuff with it, it will shatter and not dent like a stamped pan might.

My mounting situation may be different than other swaps though
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: chrispoe on August 22, 2016, 10:42:40 AM
There’s definitely a mounting difference between our cars…LOL

The back of the oil pan does hang somewhat lower, but it’s still higher up than the tranny crossmember and I still have the original bottom debris/splash shields installed that cover the oil pan too.

A level also shows that my engine is tilted forward roughly 4 degrees.
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: WashiestSnake on August 22, 2016, 02:23:33 PM
Just got back from the junkyard all the Escort GTs had their valve covers or heads taken.
Do you guys have any tips for checking a junkyard engine other then compression check, and crank turn? Also is there any aftermarket engine mounts? I cant seem to find any.

Also quick question will this suspension work? I didnt feel like starting a new thread for suspension stuff.  http://m.ebay.com/itm?itemId=191615757590  I see there is a model thats for the GTX, but would this be the correct model for our cars?

Also what happened with my Avatar? It doesnt show up on my phone at all.
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: Crapi Attitude on August 24, 2016, 03:52:05 PM
You probably want to swap the clutch slave cylinder for one from an Escort or Protege, as the Capri one won't clear the engine face plate. I used the Capri slave mounted at a cockeyed angle because I'm cheap and lazy.

My slave cylinder blew out. Either the screwy angle did it in, or it was just another crappy part. I replaced it with an Escort slave, which fit properly. The piston rod was about 5/8" too long so I cut it down and ground he edges to sit in the piston dish. I drove 15ish miles around town so far, and it worked great.
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: Gaz on September 14, 2016, 10:10:20 PM

Physically, the BP is about an inch longer than the stock 1.6L engine. This creates clearance issues. Also for this reason, the manifolds do not interchange. You will need a complete BP with manifolds.

http://www.neukin.com/Mazda_323_B6T_BP_Turbo_Manifold_p/mazdabpb6t323.htm

Why does this state it can fit either?
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: Crapi Attitude on September 15, 2016, 02:15:03 AM
Maybe they make two versions. I seem to remember holding my B6 manifold up to the BP and not being remotely close to fitting.
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: chrispoe on September 15, 2016, 03:33:22 AM

Physically, the BP is about an inch longer than the stock 1.6L engine. This creates clearance issues. Also for this reason, the manifolds do not interchange. You will need a complete BP with manifolds.

http://www.neukin.com/Mazda_323_B6T_BP_Turbo_Manifold_p/mazdabpb6t323.htm

Why does this state it can fit either?

Going by what the link you provided, it sounds like they offer two different versions and weld the turbo flange you request on.
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: WashiestSnake on January 03, 2017, 07:07:56 PM
Isnt the Escort G Series hydraulic? I swore I read something somewhere about that. What issues would be caused using the NA hydraulic system?
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: Rocketman on January 03, 2017, 09:58:31 PM

Physically, the BP is about an inch longer than the stock 1.6L engine. This creates clearance issues. Also for this reason, the manifolds do not interchange. You will need a complete BP with manifolds.

http://www.neukin.com/Mazda_323_B6T_BP_Turbo_Manifold_p/mazdabpb6t323.htm

Why does this state it can fit either?

They offer(ed) a version for each engine. Im not sure they make them anymore, interesting that the page is there - I thought they discontinued their manifold. They were $650 back in the day.

Isnt the Escort G Series hydraulic? I swore I read something somewhere about that. What issues would be caused using the NA hydraulic system?

Yes, they're hydraulic, it should mesh nicely with the N/A manual trans system. Unless there's some large discrepancy with master cylinder bore sizes, you may need to upgrade it.
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: WashiestSnake on March 05, 2017, 01:18:50 PM
Quick question, ill be using a remapped Evo8 ecu and wiring harness from BP Performance, how will this change my install? The whole reason I plan on using the Evo8 ecu is because the wiring is allready ready for C.O.P and im afwul at wiring.
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: Rocketman on March 05, 2017, 03:49:56 PM
It shouldn't affect any mechanical aspects of the swap. They should be able to support you regarding the wiring.

Automotive wiring is simple!
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: WashiestSnake on March 05, 2017, 04:39:38 PM
Automotive wiring is simple!
Well I was the main designer/wirer for my high school robot team, and lets say we went threw quite a few fuses getting it up and running. We ended up doing pretty well in our series though.
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: Rocketman on March 05, 2017, 05:38:03 PM
You should be fine then.

Here's why it's simple, there's

Constant +12v
Switched +12v
Ground
Sensor wires (some are sensor supply wires: +5v, others return the signal to ECU, others are routed through the main harness to supply the gauges)

(at least this is applicable to our cars, newer stuff borderlines black magic with data lines and such)

You get the wiring diagrams/pinouts and run through the wires, matching them wire for wire.
I'm not familiar with the EVO8 ecu wiring. To get it running (after connecting everything to the engine) you should only need to apply +12v, Switched 12v, and ground to the ECU.

To get the gauges to work, you'll need to jump the sensor wires from the ECU harness to the chassis harness. I'm not sure if the EVO ecu is programmed to use the stock sensors, or if you need to add some. This is where it might get a bit tricky, as the gauges are designed to work with the stock sensor. You can get programmable gauges, get gauges with their own sensor, or simply keep the stock sensor & double up and add the extra one the ECU needs.

The start/charge harness is mostly independent of the engine harness. (which is really nice) There is a plug that jumps power to the engine harness (i think for the injectors) but the folks providing the new harness for you should have the pinout & power requirements.

The only extraneous thing I can think of that may not be accounted for is the radiator fan switch/relay, I think this is part of the engine harness, but I'm having a hard time remembering how it's routed. This isn't a big deal to sort, though - and the EVO ecu may have a programmable/digital trigger for this anyway.
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: chrispoe on March 06, 2017, 08:14:14 PM
Like Rocketman said, automotive wiring is easy.

Actually the BF engine harness connects to the driverside fender harness via three wires(blue=12V engine fuse, black/white=12V ignition switch, and yellow/blue tach signal). When you remove the BF engine harness, you’ll also end up removing the main injection system relay that is wired directly into the engine harness on the BF. So you’ll need to either splice the old relay or a universal to the blue and black/blue wire on the fender to provide power to the engine harness for the injectors and coils. (this was part of the reason why I used the engine fuse box from the escort cuz it already has a relay for injection and cooling fan built into it.)

The starting/charging harness is completely separate of the engine harness and already contains the voltage and oil pressure signals to the instrument cluster.
The instrument cluster’s engine temp gauge and radiator fan switch have their own wiring harness that comes out from the radiator fan harness next to the driverside headlight bucket.
The only instrument gauge that comes from the engine harness is the tach signal.  IMHO…This will be the trickiest part cuz the EVO ecu uses a sourcing +5V as a tach trigger while the Capri tach uses a 0V sinking tach. I explained a work around for this on Clubprotege a while ago.

The underdash wiring will require some minor work to wire the ecu and fuel pump relay. You also need to add two jumper wires to the dash harness to retain the key reminder chime and to make the radiator fan operate via the coolant switch.(I reused the AC switch to operate a relay that disconnects the one  jumper so I can manually turn the radiator fan on via AC switch too) 

The wiring in the Capri may seem confusing, but it’s not bad at all. What’s very apparent is the fact the BF chassis was electrically designed for carbonated engines. Once you look at it from this prospective, it becomes very obvious the electrical system was actually an afterthought and why wiring/relays are scattered around the way they are.


For the Evo ecu swap you’ll also need the Miata CAS, map sensor, air intake sensor, coil packs, ect.... I think BP Performance sells the entire bundle for $895 if I remember correctly.
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: WashiestSnake on March 06, 2017, 08:55:14 PM
Thanks Matt, and Chris for all the help explaining stuff. Im actually getting taught from a work friend who has now become a wiring technician, so the engine harness should be good.
Title: Re: BP Swap
Post by: WashiestSnake on January 10, 2018, 08:45:50 PM
About to get started on the Escort G-Series, what axels and mounts do I use, will it be XR-2? I'm going to put a N/A BP in at the same time, if that matters....