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Author Topic: G-Series Transmission/GTX Transmission Info  (Read 8014 times)

chrispoe

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Re: G-Series Transmission/GTX Transmission Info
« Reply #15 on: July 18, 2016, 09:34:09 AM »

Thanks Matt, thats all the questions I have so far!   ;D

Now I get to wait 4 months to find all of this, the worst part is a saw a BPT with AWD tranny on Ebay 2 months ago. Too bad I didn't have the money for it.

Itís no big deal, thereís a bunch of BPTs with the AWD trannys still attached all over ebay.
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WashiestSnake

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Re: G-Series Transmission/GTX Transmission Info
« Reply #16 on: July 22, 2016, 11:05:14 PM »

Quick question would the LSD upgrade work on the AWD tranny? Am I correct in thinking that the front diff is Open, but the back is a viscous LSD, or was that changed when they switch transmissions?

Also @Matt how does the GTXR2 handle, does it have any torque steer/strange characteristics?
The plan for my car is the best handling Capri, I really wanna try to get the car down to 50/50 weight if possible. I'm guessing the GTXR2 is probably around 2800lbs with atleast a 60/40 weight distribution.

To clarify I don't plan on abusing my car, I daily it so a dead transmission is not a option at all. My goal is to be able to beat a 2011 Mustang V6(305hp) 3850lbs, but I also want a car that is streetable and remains reliable(I realize that means big money). I may do a small amount of rallying/autocross, but I don't plan that to be something that would be the main focus for my car.

Also before one of you ask, no I have no plans on switching to a different car. I love how the Capri is more of a GT car then a full blown Sports Car.
« Last Edit: July 23, 2016, 11:32:14 AM by WashiestSnake »
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1991 Mercury Capri 68,xxx Miles--Project(AWD)
1996 Lincoln Continental -- The Boat(Given to my Brother)

Rocketman

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Re: G-Series Transmission/GTX Transmission Info
« Reply #17 on: July 23, 2016, 11:23:59 AM »

The LSD does not work in the AWD tranny. The front diffs are much different.

The diffs on the BF GTX were all open. The center diff could be locked for slick weather but NOT to be used on dry pavement. (the torque split is done by different front / rear gear ratios, and this binds the center diff and will destroy it)

I think the BG center diff is viscous? I don't remember.

You can use the Miata LSD's in the rear but none were a stock option


My GTXR2 weighed in at 2900lbs after the conversion, I don't know the split.
It handled pretty much exactly like a slightly heavier stock capri. Only once did I get the rear to scoot out behind me. The one time I took it out in the snow it was all grip and then understeer.

You'll beat the mustang off the line but with the short gear ratios and lots of drivetrain loss he will overtake you once hes up to speed. my AWD fell flat on its face at 90mph. It's geared even lower than a stock XR2 so its pretty buzzy. Huge complaint of mine
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WashiestSnake

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Re: G-Series Transmission/GTX Transmission Info
« Reply #18 on: July 23, 2016, 11:37:39 AM »

Alright that's good to know, I thought it was gonna be something like that. I guess ill have to go over to ClubProtege and try and see if they have any solutions for a front LSD.

What would happen at 90mph would it just cap out? From what i've heard the top speed of the GTX should be around 140, maybe you just got a bad tranny? How much horsepower does the transmission suck up, isn't it something crazy like 25%?

With the Miata LSD is a drop in into the rear GTX sub or will I have to do a large amount of modification?

Also thanks Matt you're a great help, you really are a role model to me when it comes to these cars! :-D
« Last Edit: July 23, 2016, 12:01:44 PM by WashiestSnake »
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1991 Mercury Capri 68,xxx Miles--Project(AWD)
1996 Lincoln Continental -- The Boat(Given to my Brother)

Rocketman

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Re: G-Series Transmission/GTX Transmission Info
« Reply #19 on: July 23, 2016, 03:17:33 PM »

There are no LSD solutions for the GTX transmission, period. There are options for the Toyota transmissions.

Yes, there is significant and noticeable drivetrain loss at higher speeds. I've read it's 25-30%.

It's not a "cap" at 90. It stops accelerating very hard there. It will still go, it just takes time, and is very unlike the stock XR2.
Between the aerodynamic drag, and all the extra drive train, there's suddenly a lot less power to keep it accelerating hard. And it's not exactly short on power either

The Miata LSD will fit into the GTX rearend, it's best to have a transmission shop or someone do it who knows how to adjust pinion gears. You need the LSD axle stubs to go with it. It's a viscous unit, so it's not really going to do much. Do some reading on them. There are others that are clutch or helical type that will fit too
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azgtx

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Re: G-Series Transmission/GTX Transmission Info
« Reply #20 on: July 23, 2016, 07:53:00 PM »

Yes the Miata (91-93) vlsd will fit into the BF GTX rear diff. I just had one rebuilt. The vlsd will work fine for a street car or even a track car. The hotter they get the better they work and they are maintenance free other than changing oil. You can also "try" to find a Mazdaspeed lsd. These are a plate type diff and will need servicing eventually. They came in 1.5( lock on accel ) or a 2.0 ( lock on acel and decel) which I also have one of those and they really wake the car up in and out of the corners. Trolling on yahoo japan might come up with something but they are sheer unobtainium anymore. If you want a 91-93 Miata vlsd with the stub axles I have one for sale. Skip the thought of an lsd in the BF GTX awd tranny. You might as well use the BG GTX or GTR awd tranny which does have a viscous front lsd unit.
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WashiestSnake

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Re: G-Series Transmission/GTX Transmission Info
« Reply #21 on: July 24, 2016, 12:06:08 AM »

Yes the Miata (91-93) vlsd will fit into the BF GTX rear diff. I just had one rebuilt. The vlsd will work fine for a street car or even a track car. The hotter they get the better they work and they are maintenance free other than changing oil. You can also "try" to find a Mazdaspeed lsd. These are a plate type diff and will need servicing eventually. They came in 1.5( lock on accel ) or a 2.0 ( lock on acel and decel) which I also have one of those and they really wake the car up in and out of the corners. Trolling on yahoo japan might come up with something but they are sheer unobtainium anymore. If you want a 91-93 Miata vlsd with the stub axles I have one for sale. Skip the thought of an lsd in the BF GTX awd tranny. You might as well use the BG GTX or GTR awd tranny which does have a viscous front lsd unit.
The plan is to use the BPT AWD transmission, mostly because its stronger and its just plain easier to get. Im currently saving up money for the engine, and transmission If i'm lucky in a few months ill be able to pick it up. After that if you still have it I'd definitely be interested in the LSD. Why is the tranny considered "glassy" if it was able to handle 240hp stock from a GTR?

 Im really worried about finding the axels, and subframe/diff, I cant find anything on ebay or any of the GTX Facebook pages.

 im seriously worried about finding a tuning shop that has a Dyno for AWD cars, thats gonna make getting a tune a pain. @Matt Why did you remove the Megasquirt from the GTXR2?

EDIT:Found BF GTX Axels
« Last Edit: July 25, 2016, 04:48:06 AM by WashiestSnake »
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1991 Mercury Capri 68,xxx Miles--Project(AWD)
1996 Lincoln Continental -- The Boat(Given to my Brother)

WashiestSnake

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Re: G-Series Transmission/GTX Transmission Info
« Reply #22 on: July 25, 2016, 07:15:12 PM »

Just found some new info on CLubProtege, Apprerntly the RAV4 AWD tranny e-series should fit, but that was only talking about with the B6T. So what are your guys thoughts?
Link: http://www.clubprotege.com/forum/showthread.php?62876-Celica-GT4-trans-in-a-BF/page2
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1991 Mercury Capri 68,xxx Miles--Project(AWD)
1996 Lincoln Continental -- The Boat(Given to my Brother)

Rocketman

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Re: G-Series Transmission/GTX Transmission Info
« Reply #23 on: July 25, 2016, 10:37:50 PM »

Why is the tranny considered "glassy" if it was able to handle 240hp stock from a GTR?

Because the GTR transmission is not a GTX transmission. Any of these will blow up if launched and abused.
The GTR tranny had better treatments on the gears in it if I recall right

I took the Megasquirt out because the Rocketchip was running my BP just fine at the conservative boost levels I was running to save stress on the transmission. I was running 12psi on the tbird which made for a ridiculously quick Capri
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WashiestSnake

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Re: G-Series Transmission/GTX Transmission Info
« Reply #24 on: July 25, 2016, 10:54:07 PM »

When searching on ebay is there anyway to tell externally which varient of the AWD Tranny it is? Like is there any external differences between the GTX, and the GTR trans?

Do you think the Rav4 trans would work if I took and upgraded the Capri to BG front suspension to make it so that the axels would work?
« Last Edit: July 26, 2016, 11:59:11 AM by WashiestSnake »
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1991 Mercury Capri 68,xxx Miles--Project(AWD)
1996 Lincoln Continental -- The Boat(Given to my Brother)

Rocketman

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Re: G-Series Transmission/GTX Transmission Info
« Reply #25 on: July 28, 2016, 11:18:13 PM »

BG suspension is not an easy fit to the Capri. The suspension geometries are very different. I know its been done. AWD BG rear too?

GTR engine/tranny is going to be way more expensive and sold as such. Whatever you see is likely GTX

It's possible to have custom axles machined to use Rav4 inner CV cups and stock Capri outer cups. This would solve a lot of issues except for the one with the wallet lol
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chrispoe

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Re: G-Series Transmission/GTX Transmission Info
« Reply #26 on: July 31, 2016, 02:49:50 AM »

My GTXR2 weighed in at 2900lbs after the conversion, I don't know the split.
It handled pretty much exactly like a slightly heavier stock capri. Only once did I get the rear to scoot out behind me. The one time I took it out in the snow it was all grip and then understeer.

You'll beat the mustang off the line but with the short gear ratios and lots of drivetrain loss he will overtake you once hes up to speed. my AWD fell flat on its face at 90mph. It's geared even lower than a stock XR2 so its pretty buzzy. Huge complaint of mine
OuchÖ.2900LBS, and I was worried about breaking 2400LBS with a KL swapÖLOL

The BF GTX has the same gear ratios as the XR2 except the final drive ratio is 4.1 instead of 3.85. Thatís only a 6-7% increase in RPMs and that doesnít seem too bad to me.

Why is the tranny considered "glassy" if it was able to handle 240hp stock from a GTR?
 
My spec sheets say the GTX came with 161hp and the GTR came with 182hp. I do believe Rocketman is right about the GTR tranny gears being shot-peened, but it really didnít help much do to the issue of the trannyís case flexing.

BG suspension is not an easy fit to the Capri. The suspension geometries are very different. I know its been done.
I did a write-up last year comparing the BF(Capri)to the BG (Escort GT)knuckles.
http://www.teamcapri.com/forum/index.php/topic,3389.0.html   

I upgraded to BG knuckles on the front of my Capri last year and the swap wasnít too hard.
I reused my stock struts and slotted the strutís upper knuckle mounting holes 5mm higher and 2mm over, then welded a washer on each side of the strutís flange to reinforce the new bolt hole location. Then I used the larger/taller Escort GT outer tie-rod end to correct for the BG's lower steering arm and the longer inner tie-rods from a late 80ís Chevy/Geo Spectrum w/ manual rack.
« Last Edit: July 31, 2016, 02:59:50 AM by chrispoe »
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WashiestSnake

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Re: G-Series Transmission/GTX Transmission Info
« Reply #27 on: July 31, 2016, 06:13:34 AM »

You guys are awesome!! So Chris are you running the power steering still or did you convert your Capri to just manual? Also are you going to do a swap guide for the 1.8?  Because to be honest im not scared of swapping in the AWD since I have Matt's pictures. The 1.8l swap makes me nervous because i'm not sure how to do it..

Also I wouldn't consider 2900lbs all that bad when you have 225hp.

But yea thats all the questions I have, I plan on leaving this thread dead till I get the components I need.
« Last Edit: July 31, 2016, 10:08:06 AM by WashiestSnake »
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1991 Mercury Capri 68,xxx Miles--Project(AWD)
1996 Lincoln Continental -- The Boat(Given to my Brother)

chrispoe

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Re: G-Series Transmission/GTX Transmission Info
« Reply #28 on: August 08, 2016, 10:30:17 AM »

You guys are awesome!! So Chris are you running the power steering still or did you convert your Capri to just manual? Also are you going to do a swap guide for the 1.8?  Because to be honest im not scared of swapping in the AWD since I have Matt's pictures. The 1.8l swap makes me nervous because i'm not sure how to do it..
I seized the power steering pump in my car like 6 years ago while the RPMs were 7500+ and never bothered to fix it. I just connected the lines together and bypassed the pump.  The only reason I would bother fixing it was if I upgraded to the quicker rack from a MX6/Probe.

Swapping the BP will be easier then converting the car to AWD. I havenít worked on the guide for a while now, but Iím about half way done though. Unfortunately there arenít many good pics to go with it due to the fact that when I did my swap, decent digital cameras were really expensive.


Also I wouldn't consider 2900lbs all that bad when you have 225hp.
Thatís just for acceleration, what about braking and cornering?

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WashiestSnake

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Re: G-Series Transmission/GTX Transmission Info
« Reply #29 on: August 08, 2016, 06:10:20 PM »

Im going to upgrade to the big brake kit, If that isnt good enough I guess ill have to try and find some better then stock escort rotors, and pads.

For cornering im gonna go through my whole suspension and upgrade the bushings to polyperathane and have full adjustable coil overs and a better then stock anti roll bars. Im looking at probably 2.5-4k in suspension alone and thats gonna be the first thing im gonna do.

Any help pointing me in the right direction is fine, im new to all of this so I want to go slow.
« Last Edit: August 08, 2016, 06:12:03 PM by WashiestSnake »
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1991 Mercury Capri 68,xxx Miles--Project(AWD)
1996 Lincoln Continental -- The Boat(Given to my Brother)
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